SF Marathon Part II: So why so much slower after 26 years?

I was actually pretty happy with my performance, since my trail ultra times have been much slower, and I wasn’t too confident how I would hold up to all that pavement running. I was also very happy just to be able to do the event, grateful that my 53-year old body, despite its nagging aches and pains, is holding up as well as it is. But why am I slower than I was 26- 27 years ago? Well aging is the obvious excuse, but what does that mean, and is it in any way correctable? Does that mean I have less muscle mass, less strength to work with? Does that mean that my heart is weaker, or just slower? Does that mean my muscles and limbs have lost elasticity and/or I have reduced running economy now? Is my higher blood pressure putting too much load on my heart? Do I have endothelial dysfunction and the muscles are being starved (relatively) of the blood flow they need? Or can it all be attributed to increased weight?

I subsequently ran several other marathons during that time period: Summit Marathon- from Los Gatos to Soquel (across the Santa Cruz mountains, another 3:45 - it was tough!), Oakland and Avenue of the Giants. I tried (and failed) to qualify for Boston at Oakland (the qualifying time was 3:20 at the time, but my calf froze up so badly during the cold rain of that race that I had to back off the pace) for a 3:27. Avenue of the Giants was a 3:34, perhaps still overly cautious with the calf muscle. Still, I was at the point in my mid twenties where sub 3:30 was quite doable. I suppose the other piece of evidence I have is that a couple of years later, after starting grad school, I talked a bunch of other students into trying a marathon (Shamrock Marathon at Virginia Beach). I thought I had prepared much the same as before, training in the hills of Charlottesville, but only managed a 4:15. Maybe there was something magical about that early training on the Bay Area hills…

It’s possible that I stumbled upon a useful training program back in 1981-82, where my usual run was about 5.5 miles on some flat but also some pretty tough hills (the Dish loop). It’s possible that I was just lucky and managed to train hard enough without injury long enough to make good progress. It was all very intuitive- I just trained by how I felt on any given day. It’s possible that the bicycle commuting I did added some extra fitness. It’s all still a mystery to me. It’s also possible that I was still significantly undertrained if I wanted to know what my real potential could be. Given what I know about my training at the time in comparison with what I read about now, it seems that I should have been able to progress even further, perhaps to 3:15, maybe less, though I doubt that I had the potential to do much better than 3 hours.

A very rough calculation/guesstimate of my VO2max based on performances from my mid-twenties is 45 ml/min/kg (based on a 7:57 minute per mile marathon pace), with the caveats that 1) this is not the correct way to determine VO2max of course, 2) I could probably have gone at a faster pace had I trained better and not gotten injured, and 3) my VO2max in 2009 could be very different from my estimated VO2 max from 1983, but this is the best data I have at the moment. In other words, I haven’t sprung for a proper test, so this estimate will have to do for now. This number is not merely imagined, but is based on a chart in Noakes’ book "Lore of Running" where various paces are correlated with weight normalized VO2max values. Having a good VO2max is helpful in achieving good running performance, but it is well known that being able to sustain a higher percentage of your VO2max effort is more influential on running performance than VO2max itself. Superior running economy and other nebulous factors are also important in determining who is actually faster. Noakes discusses these quite a bit in his book. See also Lyle McDonald's post for more discussion about predictors of endurance performance, and VO2 max in particular, or the extensive writings on Alan Couzen's blog .

A correlation to of this VO2max chart with marathon paces to my current values would look something like this: as of race day, I weighed about 144* lbs (65.5 kg); in my marathon running mid-twenties I (think I) weighed about 125 lbs (56.8 kg). Assuming nothing else fundamental has changed, in absolute terms, I should have the heart and lungs and leg muscles etc for a VO2max of 2556.8 ml/min (multiplying by the 56.8 kg). Dividing by my now increased mass, that yields a VO2max of 39.0 ml/min/kg and a predicted marathon pace of 9:08 per mile, or about 4 hours. This happens to be closer to my predicted Yasso 800 marathon time of 4:10 than what I actually did in July (4:31), but still seems to indicate I should be able to do close to a 4 hour marathon if the only adjustment to VO2max was added weight. My 2009 performance (10:13 minute per mile marathon pace) would suggest a VO2max of ~34 ml/min/kg. Maybe this wasn’t a best effort due to not being able to stretch out a bit more in the first half, and also by the fact that I had no muscle soreness the days after, that would seem to suggest I didn’t push the pace as much as I maybe could have. Of course, VO2max doesn’t tell the whole story- there are many accounts of people being faster without having a higher VO2max. It’s also possible that I have less lung capacity due to past bouts with pneumonia- the x-rays do show some scarring.

Of course the most likely explanation is that I’m just poorly trained/more cautious now. According to “Hadd’s Take on Distance Training” (skip ahead to part 6 if you want to see how to calculate marathon heart rate (HR) and training HR), marathon HR should be 15 – 20 bpm slower than max HR. In other words, if properly trained and motivated, you should be able to maintain an effort for marathon distance at 15 – 20 bpm slower than max HR, but it shouldn’t feel uncomfortable. According to this calculation, my marathon HR should be more like 155 than 145. That HR for me right now translates into about a 9:00 – 9:10 pace- much closer to the Yasso 800 predicted time, and in good agreement with my estimates from VO2max calculations, but still pretty difficult to maintain.

So why didn’t I run nearer 155? Good question, don’t really know. Some of it is a sense of cautiousness, that I maybe shouldn’t overstress myself, at least not pushing too much. Running at a HR of 155 feels pretty hard to me these days- it’s not hard enough to be reduced to frantic panting, but it feels too hard to maintain for more than a few miles. Perhaps I need to follow more of Hadd’s suggested training and develop my aerobic potential as far as I can and then see how it goes. It’s surprisingly hard to do though- the natural inclination is to run at a pace that feels good- that pace tends to be slightly anaerobic though, especially when rested and feeling good, but not really sustainable for miles and miles.

Another posting on Chuckie V’s site addresses this further. This post basically says that lots of mileage is what makes for superior runners, and points out that the qualifying times for Boston have been eased up over the years because people are training differently, relying on “quality” higher intensity workouts rather than higher mileage. Alan Couzens also addressed this recently, pointing out that research supports the idea that aerobic adaptation in slow twitch fibers is linear with increasing exercise stimulus, suggesting that easier training for several hours per day could provide further increases in training effectiveness. This is not true for threshold/”high intensity” training, the improvements from which maxed out in some studies at about 1 hour. The good news is that you don’t have to kill yourself with exhausting stressful training to see the benefit, and it also accrues over years, even decades! Of course, there is a place for higher intensity training, to increase lactate threshold and sharpen up your speed, or for fun. Anyone who runs on hilly terrain can hardly avoid some higher intensity work on occasion anyway, but the bulk of the training does not have to be “hard.” This training philosophy is not currently fashionable, and I may not be able to manage much more mileage than I currently do anyway (40-65 miles per week), but I can try.

There is a pretty clear correlation of age with heart rate, and it seems that a slowed heart rate should have an effect on my slower performance as well. At this point it’s hard to know since I don’t know what HR numbers I was dealing with in my youth (though I'm sure they were much higher than now), and since my resting HR (and max HR) keeps dropping now. But according to the calculation above, the real limitation resulting in my slower performance is my excess weight, i.e., if I could maintain my marathon HR (a big IF) I would perform at a level that is scaled down by my greater mass. So theoretically, if I lost down to 125 lbs again, I should be able to perform as well as I could in my twenties? This seems unlikely, but worth the experiment. I’ll keep working on it.

*Currently at 139! Yea!

Fremont Fat Ass 50K run report (or running while injured)

I have been suffering from an injury of late that is threatening to derail any short term race plans I have. The injury is hard to pinpoint but is loosely in the gluts/ piriformis/ ilio-psoas areas. See GetBodySmart for a great site the shows anatomy and physiology in a way that you can clearly see what each muscle does and where it attaches.

It’s not clear exactly what the problem is, or why it showed up suddenly. I can’t tell if the problem is from a change in training to more street/track/tempo running (less steep hills, more consistent running) or the difficult trails we did two weeks ago. It would be ridiculous to be out of shape for trail running because of doing predominantly street running for a few weeks, but that is the possible root of the problem. David of course is immune from injury—at least it seems so most of the time. I blame it on the testosterone (keeps his muscles strong even when he doesn’t exercise! Men have it sooo easy!)

After recurrences of pain in the last couple weeks, mostly on the downhills when I would attempt to stretch out my stride and enjoy the ride, I decided I needed to nip this in the bud and not wait another few weeks to see if it would get better on its own like I did last summer. I went to see a physical therapist last Thursday, who gave me a whole bunch of exercises to do (toe and heel walking and core strengthening exercises).

Of course I hadn’t had much time to do the exercises or change anything by the run on Saturday, so it was with some concern that we showed up for the run on Saturday AM. I wasn’t sure I’d get all that far before having to call it quits. I was well anesthetized with Aleve, but was forced to further supplement with ibuprofen eventually in order to finish. Not so good really.

As for the run, I took it very easy and ran much of the first half with Mountain Man Steve who is successfully recovering from a calf injury and preparing for Coyote Two Moons, and Jim Winne who was deliberately keeping his heart rate down to accommodate his heart problems. As expected, after about 5 miles, the pain began, despite keeping the pace down. The course was quite easy, with clear dirt or paved trails, 90% flat or very gradual hills, perfect weather. Every time I tried to get the pace up though, I had to back off or was forced to walk. Ten minute miles (preferably 10:30 to 11) were about as fast as I could go without more serious warnings, and pushing it into 9:30 pace did some damage. Average heart rate for the run was only 137! That’s pretty slow and easy.

The weather was cooperative (cool and overcast with only a little drizzle). There was even an aid station! I met more great runners: the famous ultrarunners Chihping Fu
(thanks for the aid station!), Barbara Elia and Linda McFadden. There were lots of other great folks out there but I couldn’t spend much time talking with everyone due to pace differences and didn’t get everyone’s names. (Apologies to those I am neglecting to mention!) It was also nice to talk with the faster folks at the finish (Mike Palmer and Catra , the co-RDs, thanks for the pizza and beer, Ron!). Catra was recovering nicely from her IT band problems from HURT and seemed ready for more! Everyone was having fun and taking it easy, just a fun run on a Saturday (see participants and finishing times)!

I stayed reasonably well fueled I think despite skimping on breakfast (coffee and a Trio bar), and ate half a turkey sandwich, a Mountain Dew, and a whey protein energy bar. That’s not a lot of food, but I ate every time I felt I needed to. David again did the distance on near-zero carbs: coconut milk and whey protein (and not that much of either) as his major calorie sources.

Since I was forced to keep to a very slow pace by the pain in my butt and thigh, it was an interesting test of purely aerobic exercise vs. my usual sort of 50K race performance (as much lactic acid as I can stand). The funny thing is that on the day after this easy run, I saw the usual 2 lb weight gain again. I thought that maybe the post-race weight gain was due to the stress of hard running and wouldn’t happen after an easy run. Now I’m wondering if it’s just due to overindulging afterwards in carbs (new glycogen stores add water weight) from the post-run and dinner refueling: pizza, beer, sushi, sweet potato, cherries and bread. That’s a lot more carbs than I usually eat in a day, so maybe I carb-loaded after the run (now that’s just silly).

The aftermath of the 50K wasn’t too bad in terms of muscle pain and stiffness on Sunday. I felt a lot worse after going to the track last night and trying to get the pace up again for a short tempo run. Something’s definitely not right, and I will probably have to back off from anything faster for a while (including races) and concentrate on core exercises and going slow, if at all. So frustrating!

We Were Selected in the Miwok Lottery! YIKES!

We found out on Saturday that we made it into Miwok 100K, and I am excited and a bit terrified. Our first 50 miler was Firetrails 50 last October, after a series of pitiful 50K trail run times (at least for me), and was a purely spontaneous desire for adventure and experience. We made it well enough within the cutoff times, though not at all speedily, and I ended up thinking that I could have gone further if necessary (though I was almost too tired to eat at the end! For me, that’s pretty tired!) So, in principle, this 100K shouldn’t be such a scary ordeal. I think part of the scariness is the fact that I’ve seen these hills up there in the Headlands, and they are not to be trifled with. The other aspect is that this isn’t just spontaneous, we’ve signed up 5 months in advance. That’s 5 months to plan, worry and fret! (oh yeah, and prepare!)

It also brings up the question of what other races to include in the 2009 schedule, and how to train for these events. I’d really like to do a regular street marathon (in a time that doesn’t embarrass me too much) and am considering Napa Valley Marathon on March 1st. But is training for a street marathon compatible with training for Miwok? Inquiring minds want to know (at least this inquiring mind does!) Training for a street marathon, as I understand it, involves training to increase running efficiency and maximize fat burning while flirting with your lactate threshold (a little too fast and you pay a painful price, a little too slow and you, well, take a little longer). Training for Miwok though—that’s trails and hills and trails and hills, ad finitum, well up to about 16 hours worth if you’re near the back of the pack as I suspect I will be, figuring out what gear to use and training your feet and everything else for the challenge. They seem like incompatible objectives. Please feel free to jump in here with advice, though probably at this point it’s too late to make much of a difference anyway…

Another race I’d like to include is the Diablo 50 miler, about two weeks before Miwok. Maybe that’s cutting it too close, I don’t know. I think it depends on how aggressive we are about that race—after Firetrails, I had swollen ankles and legs and was up 3 lbs of fluid for most of a week. But it’s possible we are adapting somewhat because the ankle swelling/weight gain seems to have diminished (no excessive weight gain or ankle swelling after last weekend’s 20 miles through El Corte de Madera and Purisima Creek Redwoods Open Space Preserves—and I wore myself out on those hills and have been sore all week).

In addition to training, running and more running, and oh yeah hills, we are motivated to get back onto a weight loss trend, instead of just holding steady like we have since August. I really don’t want to have to lug an extra ten or twenty pounds for the whole 100K distance. And who knows, we might even get faster too! So this is a good motivator to be more disciplined about our diet. The good news is that there was no appreciable weight gain over the holidays because we were able to mostly stick to low carb eating, even for desserts (yummy truffles and pecan pie heavy on the pecans and light on the sugary filling). I am not disciplined about food, and have enjoyed the low carb/paleo diet because I do not have to be disciplined (unless someone is waving carbs in front of my face). I cannot stand being hungry and feeling deprived. Still, something’s gotta give. David is really getting frustrated—he was down to 185 lbs briefly in the summer, but went back up over 190 after we started ultrarunning (now on a downtrend again). And running more only seemed to make the weight go up a little more. Since our last 50K on December 13th we’ve been taking it easier, taking more rest days and putting in easier distances mostly, shallower hills, moderate heart rate training. But that hasn’t done anything to help get the weight loss going again either. So now we’re going to try to be more cognizant at least of total calories and cheats and see if the weight won’t come off again. Wish us luck!

Training do’s and don’ts

Just for fun, not that we are any kind of expert runners (ha!), we decided to put in our two cents in the TIaRT forum on training do’s and don’ts (I know it’s Friday already!). Some of these thoughts are pretty empirical and based on practical experience over the years, but similar advice is given on the endurancecorner.com training website.

DO:

• Do eat high quality nutrition—limit simple carbs, especially if you are trying to keep the weight off (in contrast to the previous conventional wisdom, you don’t need to replace all 400 to 500 g of glycogen stores everyday in an ordinary training day! We keep our intake to probably <100g, but the absolute amount is up to you and perhaps governed by the intensity of your training). Get plenty of vitamins and omega -3 fats and sufficient protein using fresh veggies and meats/fish/cheese/nuts, including vitamin supplements if necessary.
• Do get sufficient rest–get enough Z’s, take a day off once in a while or just take a walk instead of feeling like you have to run everyday
• Do alternate hard days with easier days and hard weeks with easier weeks
• Do experiment with hill work, tempo training, track intervals, etc. to see how you’re doing under different conditions, and race once in a while just for the feedback and fun
• Do try crosstraining and/or weight lifting to work on specific muscle and core muscle strengthening
• Do make sure you throw in plenty of Goldilocks days (not too hard, not too easy, just the right amount of effort)
• Do evaluate yourself critically and welcome feedback from others, then work on your deficiencies (don’t just gloat about your strengths)
• Do pay attention to what your muscles and joints are telling you. Sore or tired muscles may need to be warmed up more slowly or rested. Extensive stretching before exercise may be losing favor as a routine practice, but if you have a muscle that is tight or tending to cramp, or other problem areas, do stretch it carefully before and after your run.
• Do start slowly. We often find that we don’t “reach our stride” until about 45 minutes or more into a run. Even under race conditions, be careful not to push too hard too early. Do be patient and consistent
• Do use a plan if you’re into it, but I’ve had success (some years ago anyway) just winging it and doing what it seemed needed doing (long runs some days, easy on others, track work to speed up a bit, crosstraining on the bike)

DON’T:

• Don’t overtrain (back off to really easy once in a while–you’ll know when you need it when your legs are just beat or you start to resent your workouts)
• Don’t push through pain all the time—sometimes it goes away if you’re patient, but sometimes it means you need to lay off the hard/long stuff for a while, maybe do some cross training for a week or two or more
• Don’t get discouraged—as the Tao Te Ching says “sometimes things are easy and sometimes things are hard…”. You can be sure that what is hard today will someday be easier, and then again, what is easy today will be hard someday when you’re injured or sick.
• Don’t worry about what other people think— sure you may look like a dork sometimes, we all do, but you can’t try to look great all the time if it means you’re running a pace far too fast to sustain just to impress others. It can mean the difference between a merely respectable time (ok maybe even a poor time) and not even finishing a race.
• Don’t be afraid of a challenge. If you’re not really ready for the challenge, so what? You’ll know what your baseline novice level is and be able to do better next time. Every race, every challenge, will teach you something different about preparation, psychology and equipment that will come in handy later.

One final thought—from reading other contributions on this topic, it’s clear that there is a wide variety of approaches, from those wanting every training detail spelled out to those (like us) just feeling our way along. We haven’t even figured out what races we’re doing this year yet, so it’s hard to begin a training plan! Right now I’m toying with the idea of a road marathon (Napa Valley? Probably haven’t a prayer of a respectable time [i.e., close to finishing times from my distant past], but we may decide to run it anyway just for a baseline number), and we’re waiting to hear about the lottery for Miwok 100K (what the F--- was I thinking?), and of course there’s Diablo 50-miler and some other killer ultra trail events coming up… We’ll see what happens. In the meantime, we’re putting in some easier mileage and watching to see if the heart rate drops with mostly aerobic training as it supposed to do when you’re improving (it does seem to be happening, if slowly). We’re also putting in some tempo runs and track workouts to train for a faster pace that is sub lactate threshold (LT2, as best I can tell where that is—seems to be about 8:30 pace right now for me and maybe 7:30 pace for David) but this is a pace that neither of us can sustain indefinitely. Running on a track is very different from running on trails, especially hilly ones, so we will probably end up incorporating a lot more hills eventually (sure would have helped at Muir Beach!).